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Some Say They Want Feedback But Really Want1125

Forum Owner Belew private msg quote post Address this user
People say they want feedback.

What they really want is for people to say nice things to them. To puff them up. To praise them.

And for sure ... praise is appropriate sometimes.

But what we really need is for people to be honest with us. To tell us what doesn't work. To give recommendations. To care enough about our feelings to hurt our feelings out of genuine concern to make us better people, better at what we do.

Wise King Solomon said it this way, "As iron sharpens iron, so one person sharpens another."

Who do you rub up against?
Where do you get your feedback?
When do you give feedback?
How do give you feedback?

Remember ... nobody cares what you know until they know that you care. Feedback starts with a real love for the person you are offering it to.
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Member bdaoust private msg quote post Address this user
@Belew

I think it all depends on how the feedback is given. If it is genuine criticism to help that person be better, or improve what they are working on,,,there should be no issue.

If the feedback is a negative attack, then there is an issue. No one wants negativism, we all want positive. If the feedback is constructive, the negativism most often goes away.

Now for the acceptance part. We all know what we need to do with the feedback. It is just that we take it as a personal attack and lack the will to accept it and act on it.

Get you out of the equation, and focus on the product. No one wants to buy anything where is the quality is lacking. Feedback is the only way you can possibly improve.
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Forum Owner Belew private msg quote post Address this user
@bdaoust

These are good thoughts all around.

It's hard to not take feedback personal when the creator or the product is so personally invested.

Writers, artists get really passionate about their work ... and rightfully so.

They can also be quite defensive.

I try to be open ... but I am not always.

Churchill said, "I like to learn, but I don't always like being taught."

Where do you go to get feedback?
Post 3 • IP   flag post
Member bdaoust private msg quote post Address this user
@Belew

Always start with someone that does not have a vested interest and not to jut one person. I go to 3 and get all the comments and feedback. Some will be thorough and some will be sketchy.

Getting my head out of it, you are right, it is not always easy.

I then get another person to go over the feedback and agree or disagree (now there are 4). Then I take back the work and decide on the changes.

My daughter wrote a Fantasy Novel (which is now published) and she had the most difficult time accepting the reviews from an author that does extremely well in the field. The trick I gave her was to keep her original manuscript as her prize possession and then take the feedback and create something new.

We split tested the two versions (easy to do in the self-publishing world and Amazon). Her self-esteem is still intact and her new creation is doing ok.
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Forum Owner Belew private msg quote post Address this user
@bdaoust

Good strategy with your daughter.

How did the split test turn out?
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Member Jonnner private msg quote post Address this user
@Belew

Great topic!

This forum provides the opportunity to receive great advice. But, you need to be willing to receive it.

For example @Rev recently gave me some great advice about my Website at www.Taligo.com As a result of his advice I have:

Thanked @Rev

Deleted some excessive restrictions that I had put into the WordFence plugin that were locking him out

Added the Redirection Plugin to fix some 301 and 404 errors

I also changed my LinkedIn profile URL in my BillBellew.com forum profile to solve a 404 that @morrnel encountered. Thanks again @Morrnel.

In the future I will:

Think through @Rev's advice in Q4-Q1 when I execute a planned Website redesign. At that time I will also ask him what device he used to access my Website as I believe that it my site renders well for iPhone Android and Windows 7.

Other comments on www.Taligo.com are most welcome.
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Forum Owner Belew private msg quote post Address this user
@Jonnner

Thanks for the kind words for the forum.

I sent you an inmail as well.
Post 7 • IP   flag post
Teacher Rev private msg quote post Address this user
I really enjoy this forum.

There are awesome people here... those who share and those who seek.

The exchanges are friendly, informative, in depth.

Considering the topic of this thread, my great grandmother taught me to always find/say three good things about something before pointing out the bad. It tends to lessen the blow. The recipient, already feeling good about the first three things tends to handle the next, perhaps less than good, point easier and with more understanding.

Sometimes, there just isn't any downside.
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Member jycmba private msg quote post Address this user
@Rev - I stubbornly used to believe that it's not HOW you say something but WHAT you say that matters.. boy, did I have a lot to learn!

Today I realize that if you don't appreciate HOW people need you to say something, it won't matter WHAT you say!
Post 9 • IP   flag post
Forum Owner Belew private msg quote post Address this user
@Rev

Next time you talk to me here in the forum I am going to count to three, then take a deep breath and wait for number 4.
Post 10 • IP   flag post
Member bdaoust private msg quote post Address this user
@Belew

The split test showed she sold many more books that had the edits as suggested. She has since pulled her original work down and letting the other book sell.
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Forum Owner Belew private msg quote post Address this user
Split testing works when you have enough numbers to split. 8-)
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Member morrnel private msg quote post Address this user
I wonder if it has anything to do with how we define and use the two words criticism and feedback and we confuse one with the other.

Many people like to use the terms "constructive criticism", "negative feedback". I use them too. They are oxymorons.

Criticism is an attack. Responding to attack is in our DNA. We instinctively resist and protect ourselves from it as if it were a sabre tooth tiger.

When someone asks for feedback, that person did not ask to be attacked. Think about how the words come out of your mouth. The best a person can do is tell what you would do differently and let them decide.
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Member lunar_ranger private msg quote post Address this user
No one wants to be told why they're wrong. They want to be told how they can be more "right".
Post 14 • IP   flag post
Teacher Rev private msg quote post Address this user
@morrnel

I guess we might say "feedback" is a position, whereas "criticsm" is a vector. I there a word that is also a vector that suggests the positive side of feedback?

Praise?
Post 15 • IP   flag post
Teacher Rev private msg quote post Address this user
@lunar_ranger

Is it not better to understand the "why" of our wrong so we can not only be more "right" now but next time as well?
Post 16 • IP   flag post
Member morrnel private msg quote post Address this user
Do I want a pat on the back vs. a path correction?
Post 17 • IP   flag post
Member lunar_ranger private msg quote post Address this user
@Rev It's all in how you frame the guidance you offer. Pride stands in the way of growth and correction. If a man can save face, learn from his choices while discovering better alternatives- he is more likely to embrace them- especially if that redirection comes externally. Teachers need to be leaders, and motivators. Once a relationship exists one can be more forward in their approach.
Post 18 • IP   flag post
Teacher Rev private msg quote post Address this user
Atta'boy, @morrnel, you nailed it! ;o)
Post 19 • IP   flag post
Member lunar_ranger private msg quote post Address this user
@morrnel A pat on the back can push/guide a person in the right direction.
Post 20 • IP   flag post
Member morrnel private msg quote post Address this user
@lunar_ranger, only if I'm already going in the right direction.

A friend from India had a really good response:

"I agree with you 100 percent. Now let me tell you why you are wrong."
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Member tienny private msg quote post Address this user
I help my ex-colleague and explain iron sharpens iron. That's the purpose of teamwork.
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Member authorbhalla private msg quote post Address this user
I know I have to learn a lot that's why I love feedback. I appreciate it in both types, Positive and Negative . Negative feedback makes me more passionate to improve.
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